Well, from what I have witnessed so far, I think it is safe to say, we would have gobbled up the Horizon this year with what we have !
The nice problem is, however, we are NOW in the MVC--GOOD !!

So far, three of our guys are capable as is for competing with the likes of Indy \St. WSU and the rest--KEKE, Thomas, and of course DOYLE
The rest of our team must and I feel shall step it up. Turk will be just right in coming off the bench--Hit two or three threes -- and then wait for second half.
Our BIGS, Osborne, King , O'Leary are projects--big enough --will they be tough enough ? Of these I feel Osborne will blossom soonest. Am concerned about O'Leary. King and the other BIG (?--mental block) will be just fine in about Feb. ALL these guys need to do is BOARD and perhaps score maybe fifteen-eighteen points or so between them. That is where it will be at--If these Bigs come through sooner than later we WILL be a force.

Now then, when all is said and done, we must develop a killer attitude--We cannot let ANY game get away as we did in the South. This is on PM for sure--BUT team must produce all game--every game.

BTW I have a sneaky hunch that Thomas will surprise the MVC--now that he has real outside talent helping.

I do not know the game as well as most of you guys do--BUT I surely like most of what I see so far--that is if the internet stream would not be so shaky !!!!!!!

Hope somene comments --, please--Thanks

I was at the opener vs. Milwaukee, and I watched the Milwaukee/Davidson game, the Wright State/DePaul game, and the UIC games vs. Northwestern and Drake. Green Bay, Wright State, Cleveland State and YSU are the cream of the crop in the HL this year. Green Bay nearly knocked off Wisconsin at home a week ago. Wright State led most of the game at DePaul before collapsing in the final three minutes. Valpo-- picked to finish sixth in the HL this year, even without Loyola in the poll-- played Ohio, Illinois, and Evansville very close on the road.

I'm not sure if Oakland would have been added to the HL if we hadn't left, but they certainly would have if UIC or Valpo had gone to the MVC instead of us. Remember, when the HL had 10 teams, the third seed had to play four games to reach the championship. I think some of the new officiating rules would have played to our advantage in the HL, but I don't think we would have finished higher than Green Bay, Wright State, or Cleveland State. Oakland was picked for fourth in the league, and came within four points of beating Cal on the road. Given our history vs. YSU, and with them having preseason POTY Kendrick Perry, I even wonder if we could top them in the standings. So I think we probably would have finished between third and fifth.

If we managed to finish fourth in the HL (or third with 10 teams), it would still mean that we'd play four games in the conference tournament, and if we somehow made it to the final, we would be playing for the third day in a row against a much better-rested home team. So finishing fourth (or third in a 10-team HL) in the standings would put us at a worse disadvantage in the conference tournament than finishing LAST in the MVC.

And then there's the many other benefits to being out of the HL.... If we want to develop that "killer instinct" that you refered to, the best way to do it is to play tougher competition, which we will be doing in the MVC. We should have a better chance at getting to a lesser postseason tournament (NIT, CIT) in the MVC than in the HL. By virtue of being in the MVC, our RPI will be higher (all other things being equal) than in the HL. Our scheduling will likely improve dramatically. Getting better teams into the Gentile Arena will improve attendance and visibility, and help build a more sustainable fan base. Etc., etc. So in other words, I'd much rather finish sixth in the MVC (thus avoiding Thursday) than third in the HL.

Well written as usual 63-- It is almost rug-cuttin' time--This tourney on the Coast will help a lot--We have a chance at a sweep--IF we go all out.
I do feel opur Keke, Milton and Christian will get us on the way---

I am staring to think it is now on PM to prove himself as a fine coach--He is a recruiter and a gentleman. He brought in the material--now go with it.

Would we be something neat with Tanner as sixth or seventh guy----Ifs and buts I guess.

RESUME RAMBLING RAMBLERS !!

I think you're right, Brot. This tournament in Portland is... or should be... a BIG DEAL. This tournament is eminently winnable for Loyola, even though it's on the road. We'd be favored against all three teams, I think, even the host. We really NEED to win these three games, because the schedule isn't going to be much easier from here on out. We need to win these games to uphold the conference RPI, and they're simply games we should win.

This trip is a big test for me. I've had doubts about Moser, and the two games in Tennessee and Louisiana made them resurface to the forefront. If we can't beat low-rated Portland State, UC Davis, and SIU-Edwardsville on consecutive nights in a mostly neutral atmosphere as our team regains nearly full strength in the third year of Moser's tenure, I think he's probably lost me for good. We simply need to win this tournament, or Moser isn't an MVC-level coach. Pure and simple.

I know that most people on this site didn't like Jim Whitesell, but I thought he was an incredible x's and o's coach. As I pointed out in another thread. Moser has lost an astounding seven games over the past year in which LU held a double-digit lead in the second half. That might be about the same as Whitesell did in seven years (I haven't looked it up).

As I wrote in the preview, this is Moser's solid-gold second chance at being a head coach. We were assured he learned things at St. Louis under Rick Majarus-- although he lost most games when he took over as head coach during Majarus' illnesses. The impression of his recruiting is favorable, but we're still without a capable center in his third year and counting. We lost a lot of games in the late stages of last year, but now the question is revolving around his coaching when we've lost two games in a row with large double-digit second half leads.

The idea that Moser deserves another year because he's now recruiting for the MVC is a fallacy. He's always gone after the best available players regardless of position-- that's why we have such a dearth in the frontcourt. It's his third year here, and he had two years' notice that Averkamp and Hicks would be graduating in 2013. Nobody he's recruited solely for Loyola (rather than St. Louis) has yet made a serious impact.

Yeah, this is an important trip out to Portland.

Brot - I'd say best case in the HL would've been middle of the pack, 5th or 6th. Or 7th. The Horizon gets a pretty bum rap around here but it certainly isn't a bad league. And Loyola doesn't qualify as a good team yet.

Pretty strong words from 63. Don't necessarily disagree with anything you've said. We talked coming into the year about needing to see the young players improve. Maybe we failed to talk about needing to see the coach get better, too. I hope for your sake that LU wins this weekend, because if we don't and then you turn on Moser...don't forget that extension. He's here for 4 more years and that's a long time to want a coach out.

It's a long trip out west and 3 games in 3 days is really tough on a team that's only playing a couple guys off the bench. Need to use the bench early and often all weekend to have a shot at winning all 3.

I'm with you, JCT. The only difference is that I'm already at the point where coach has lost me. I'm also resigned to the fact that he'll be here through his contract (or at least most of it).

Essentially, I'm in "show me" mode. Moser needs to show me that he can win...that he can make in game adjustments...that he's the guy to lead us to the promised land. Short of bringing in some talented recruits, I haven't seen the "good" Moser.

As for this weekend, I'm pessimistic. We SHOULD win all 3 games. We SHOULD have won at Tennessee Tech and Tulane. I fear that we will be coming home with 1 win in the 3 games. I hope I am wrong. I hope Moser brought the magic elixir with him. Guess we'll see what happens

_________________
Cigarboy sucks!

Yikes you guys would have fired Chris Collins after NU lost to ISU!.
4 years minimum to issue a report card. Particularly coming back from where we were. THis is the the 3rd quarter for Porter. He has completed his first semester(quarter system). THe grade is still incomplete. There have been some positives and some negatives, some unknowns and still a final exam to be issued.
I would judge the coach in 4 categories. Representing the University, player development, in-game coaching, recruiting.
Representing the University- A- Seems like a real good guy. Always optimistic and positive. Reuniting program and students. Nice kids
Player Development-B-. The guards seem to have improved. Jeff White is getting to the hoop better. Turks defense has improved. Osbourne( when he is not in foul trouble) seems way improved. Whether or not anyone could have gotten King ready I dont know. I think he just has to continue to keep physically improving.

In Game Coaching-C- Seem to run a real good help man to man, I have never like the ball-screen offense but it is what most successful programs are running these days and it does seem to produce decent shots. This year with the new rules maybe more free throws as well. Obviously the close losses count against him. Does not seem flexible. seems like he will do what he does and will ask players to fit the system. with out a legit center this year he may need to be creative. This years losses I chalk up to not having a complete roster

Recruiting C+ this would be better if he had been able to have had a center ready to replace Ben Averkamp. but he had a great first year...out recruiting NU for OSbourne.....getting Jeff White from a storied program (Peoria Manual) reconnecting with the public league with Milton Doyle and Ingram next year.( both from great Public league Programs)
Seems to have good connections in the AAU world and works hard at it.

Incompletes/Unknowns/other Factors/ I still think the loss of the assistant coaches is a big factor. Coach does not seem to use these guys much during timeouts. Is their lack of involvement a reason they leave?. This is still a really young team. Why did Cully Payne leave?

Anyway I will give PM till the end of next year. I will be looking to see if the team can start to win some close games. How he deals with not having a true center and if he can find a true center.
GO RAMBLERS

I like some of your thoughts, Smoke. Do think on the representing the university you need to include the number of guys who have been shown the door or kicked off the team in 2 years. I can't stand that and I'm guessing there are 3 that'll have the same thing happen after this year.

Recruiting - signing Payne, in hindsight, was awful. 2 years of scholarship for one season of play plsu hung high and dry for this year. You can blame the kid but given his past was it wise to sign him?

Not at all. One loss is just that. One loss. As JCT pointed out, Moser has a history of bad losses. Blowing a huge double digit lead should be an outlier...not a regular occurrence. To this point, it seems to happening more and more. Moser is in his 3rd season and is showing no differences from the first two. Losing games we should win.




I agree with this sentiment for the most part. I don't want to give the wrong impression. Coach seems like a perfectly nice guy. Whitesell was a nice guy too. Nice does not win games, though. 08 is right, though. Running off players isn't a good thing. Poor Tanner is probably going to find himself without a scholarship next year due to his health issues. We'll see how Moser handles the situation but I don't have a lot of faith that he'll do it right.




This grade seems about right. I was high on his ability to develop players. CT...Keke...Now i'm waiting on Osborne, O'leary and King.



I think you're being generous. Setting a system is great but the fact that he has lost as many games as he has when we've had big leads? Unacceptable. That, to me, is the epitome of in game coaching and I'm more likely to give him a D or failing grade.


I desperately want Moser to be successful. I want to win. I'm sick of losing and I'm sick of losing the way we continually do. Again...show me. Prove to me that Moser should be coach. That's where I am at this point. I hope I have to eat my words, but given the start to the season...I fear I'm more right than wrong.



I disagree here but more towards the other side. I think Moser's strength is his recruiting. Bringing in talented players (Doyle, Keke, Turk, etc) is great. Sure, he has missed but many coaches do. As has been pointed out, the thing that keeps him from being great is his inability to recruit ALL positions. He tends to ignore positions for most talent. That won't fly in the MVC.

_________________
Cigarboy sucks!

GR and 08
Some legit points
1. I also do not feel good about running players off but it seems like this is what happens in most programs and it seems like most of those guys ended up in more appropriate situations. Dont make it right but Im just saying..Damm Jesuit Guilt. As for Tanner...I think if he isnt cleared to play medically there is something they can do to keep him on scholarship but regain the athletic scholarship. Does anyone know the real story for Tanner. Was he the one on the bench with his leg wrapped like a mummy?

2. It is hard for me to give a complete grade on those losses as my opinion is tainted by the fact that many of those games occurred when Averkamp and Payne were injured and this year with Osbourne and others out. Add to this the fact that we were and are so young. So maybe it isnt coaching as much as it is experience and lack of depth. You have to give PM time to build depth and time for players to get experience. In other words those close losses was it strategy or execution?

3. Why do you think PM cant recruit the Big man?