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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:09 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 12:28 pm
Posts: 514
The players who go us to the highest of heights will always be remembered fondly, nothing Porter does can change that. Maybe in 25 years he can come back and we can give him a nice applause for what he accomplished leading the program. It's disappointing that his actions betrayed his slogans and book titles etc. But the Ramblers hoops existed before 2015 and will exist long after he settles into Norman. I hope he finds the happiness he didn't have here, he's earned that. The thing I'm most upset about is I thought he was our guy and he's not he's just a guy. But I'll get over that, it'll always be more about the students representing us anyway. All the faith and confidence that Steve will keep this going and we'll be ok. Just sad that the dream of Porter was just that, a dream.


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:33 pm 
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Posts: 335
I agree. I’m disappointed that PM spoke culture and loyalty... then bailed to the P5. This was his baby and I never saw him needing to tag onto a bigger program just because it’s easier. He did a great job and was m grateful. But I never saw his position here as just a job. Wish him well but can’t believe Oklahoma will be his baby. He’s their coach!


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 8:36 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:53 pm
Posts: 465
Location: Chicago, IL
Ramblerguy wrote:
I agree. I’m disappointed that PM spoke culture and loyalty... then bailed to the P5. This was his baby and I never saw him needing to tag onto a bigger program just because it’s easier. He did a great job and was m grateful. But I never saw his position here as just a job. Wish him well but can’t believe Oklahoma will be his baby. He’s their coach!


Porter did great things here and he'll always be remembered for that. He's now also going to be remembered as the guy that could have continued taking Loyola to great heights, but bailed for a P5 job after gaining some spotlight. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just sour feeling because it seemed to go against the kind of principles that we thought our coach had. we'll see how it turns out, and I hope for his sake it goes well. More importantly, I hope Loyola continues to be successful after his tenure here.


Last edited by Blers42 on Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:01 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:59 am
Posts: 129
Location: New York Fan
440Rambler wrote:
The players who go us to the highest of heights will always be remembered fondly, nothing Porter does can change that. Maybe in 25 years he can come back and we can give him a nice applause for what he accomplished leading the program. It's disappointing that his actions betrayed his slogans and book titles etc. But the Ramblers hoops existed before 2015 and will exist long after he settles into Norman. I hope he finds the happiness he didn't have here, he's earned that. The thing I'm most upset about is I thought he was our guy and he's not he's just a guy. But I'll get over that, it'll always be more about the students representing us anyway. All the faith and confidence that Steve will keep this going and we'll be ok. Just sad that the dream of Porter was just that, a dream.


Could not agree with these sentiments any more


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:03 pm 
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Posts: 3929
Location: Chicago, Illinois
I have to confess that I never understood the Porter Moser worship around here. I was extremely skeptical when he was hired.

I worked at a Sports Talk radio station in Little Rock in 2003-04, doing call screening and producing the University of Arkansas women's basketball broadcasts on a 7-station statewide network based out of Little Rock. This was just after Moser left UALR for the job at Illinois State. I remember it especially well because in his first season at ISU, while I was following Loyola in Little Rock, the Ramblers played Illinois State in Normal. This was during Larry Farmer's miserable last season at Loyola, when the Ramblers won only 9 games.... yet the Ramblers played really well against Moser's ISU squad, ultimately losing 77-71. I remember I had to go to Memphis that day, and tried to follow the game while driving... Ramblermania's Brian Payne was down in Normal and took photos of that game at Redbird Arena. I talked to some of the guys at the station, and they all felt Moser was more opportunistic than a brilliant coaching whiz.

So I thought it was funny that the Wunderkind of Little Rock got hold of a bigger Mid Major program and almost blew it against one of the worst teams Loyola put on the floor in this century (KenPom 191, but only because the Ramblers shocked Paul Biancardi's Wright State on the road in the first round of the HL tournament).

And then, a few years later, I had an opportunity to buy a house in Normal in late 2006. Loyola had their best season in 20 years in 2006-07, but Illinois State was suffering through their third losing season in Coach Moser's four years there. All four of Moser's seasons were below .500 in conference. At the end of the season (just two and a half months after I started spending time down in Normal), they pulled the plug and let Moser go. That's when Illinois State started to get very good, when Moser left. Many people claimed it was the players that Moser recruited that led to three consecutive 20-win seasons that followed Moser's time there. Others said that his successor, Tim Jankovich, played candy-ass non-con schedules that puffed up the win totals. But it's hard to make that claim when Illinois State was 6-12 in the MVC in Moser's last year, and they were 13-5 in Jankovich's first year.

The Ramblers had another brush with Moser in 2007.... another game I attended... when Loyola played at St. Louis in Moser's first season as an assistant with Rick Majerus. The Ramblers were down by only two at halftime, but the Bilikins absolutely smoked Loyola in the second half for a 60-43 win.

And so, when Loyola named Moser as their new Head Coach in 2011, I was very, very skeptical. I tweeted my displeasure in the early days of my personal twitter account.... and the @OldTakesExposed twitter folks highlighted my tweets in the week before the Final Four in 2018.

I didn't like the way Moser ran off some players when he arrived. I thought the 7-23 record in his first year, and an MCC/HL record-worst 1-17 conference record in his first year was a really, really unnecessary embarrassment to the program (and a mar on the history of the program) just so he could set a low benchmark for comparison in the years forward. I was really angry. We weren't that bad-- we had Ben Averkamp, Jordan Hicks, Walt Gibler, and Christian Thomas. We were 6-7 in non-con games, with wins over Fordham, at Toledo, at Canisius, and at Bradley-- but we got swept by every Horizon League team except for the split with UIC? Several of the players Moser ran off-- Chim Kadima, Tom Neary, Shaun Adams-- went on to Division II St. Leo, where they knocked off the ACC's Miami (FL) in an exhibition game and reached the 2nd round of the Division II tournament.

In his first year in the MVC, Moser chased off more players-- basically, everyone over 6'7". Cody Johnson (6'10"), Matt O'Leary (6'8"), Nick Osbourne (6'8"), Jeremy King (6'10"), and Tanner Williams (6'7")-- all gone. And yes, I know that Tanner Williams had shin splint and leg issues, but some people say he was pushed.

But ironically, throwing out all the traditional big men was how Moser finally hit on his winning formula. I don't know if it was by design or necessity, but within two or three games into the 2014-15 season it was obvious Moser had put together a winning strategy. It was a variation on the switching defense, positionless basketball played at successful schools like Florida State, Dayton, and VCU. The only difference was, those other schools had players who were all athletic and 6'6". Loyola had players who were mostly 6'3", 6'4", with Montel James the only guy on the entire roster over 6'6". The team depended on length, athleticism, positioning, quickness, denying inside passes, etc. It was really extraordinary, and changed my extremely negative opinion of Moser to grudging admiration.

That season, the one that changed my mind about him, was the CBI year. I still think that was an important building block for the program, one that got us to the point where we could have a season like 2018. That was also the first full year of recruiting while in the MVC. It was the debut of Ben Richardson and Donte Ingram, and the first year for juco transfers Earl Peterson and Montel James. It was the senior season for Christian Thomas. We won our MTE that year, the Continental Tire Las Vegas Invitational, by defeating Texas Tech and Boise State. Moser might have earned his first above-.500 MVC record ever if it hadn't been for Milton Doyle's injury that season that caused him to miss 11 conference games where the team went 4-7. His first winning MVC campaign would have to wait until his ninth try, in 2017-18.

I don't want to give the impression that I think Moser isn't an excellent coach, and the absolute best person to coach Loyola next season and the year after. It's going to be a huge loss for the program, even if everyone who hasn't entered the transfer portal decides to stay, and even if his successor exceeds expectations. But it is possible (maybe unlikely at first, but certainly possible within 1-2 years) that Loyola could do just fine without him.

This is a setback, but not doomsday. The things that always set back the university in coaching transitions before was an unwillingness to pay what is required and underestimating the professionalism that is required from a coach and his assistants. We have great resources, a very good conference, good recruiting ties, a high quality AD, and many other advantages.

Thanks to Coach Moser for showing the fans, administration, students, and alumni what is possible. I'm not going to waste any good wishes on him, because it's us-- Loyola, our program, our students, our fanbase, etc. that really needs all the good wishes we can get after Moser left us suddenly for a paycheck. Maybe he'll do better in Norman than he did in Normal. Thanks a lot, keep in touch.

Moving on, next man up.


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:14 pm 
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Location: Livin in the middle, between the two extremes
I know one thing: I can’t wait until the NCAA sets up the tournament bracket so that we end Porter’s Sooners’ season.


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:24 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:55 pm
Posts: 148
Agree JCT. Moser was the perfect man to get us out of the place we were in. Now we have a lot to give. Always knew he would move on. We now will have more options than before.


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:34 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 08, 2013 6:16 pm
Posts: 676
Jim Rose on ABC sports reported that PM got a six year $4million a year deal with Oklahoma. Good for him and his family.
I wish him and them well.
But time to move on. New chapter begins.


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 10:33 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:59 pm
Posts: 104
Location: Parts Unknown
JCT wrote:
I have to confess that I never understood the Porter Moser worship around here. I was extremely skeptical when he was hired.

I worked at a Sports Talk radio station in Little Rock in 2003-04, doing call screening and producing the University of Arkansas women's basketball broadcasts on a 7-station statewide network based out of Little Rock. This was just after Moser left UALR for the job at Illinois State. I remember it especially well because in his first season at ISU, while I was following Loyola in Little Rock, the Ramblers played Illinois State in Normal. This was during Larry Farmer's miserable last season at Loyola, when the Ramblers won only 9 games.... yet the Ramblers played really well against Moser's ISU squad, ultimately losing 77-71. I remember I had to go to Memphis that day, and tried to follow the game while driving... Ramblermania's Brian Payne was down in Normal and took photos of that game at Redbird Arena. I talked to some of the guys at the station, and they all felt Moser was more opportunistic than a brilliant coaching whiz.

So I thought it was funny that the Wunderkind of Little Rock got hold of a bigger Mid Major program and almost blew it against one of the worst teams Loyola put on the floor in this century (KenPom 191, but only because the Ramblers shocked Paul Biancardi's Wright State on the road in the first round of the HL tournament).

And then, a few years later, I had an opportunity to buy a house in Normal in late 2006. Loyola had their best season in 20 years in 2006-07, but Illinois State was suffering through their third losing season in Coach Moser's four years there. All four of Moser's seasons were below .500 in conference. At the end of the season (just two and a half months after I started spending time down in Normal), they pulled the plug and let Moser go. That's when Illinois State started to get very good, when Moser left. Many people claimed it was the players that Moser recruited that led to three consecutive 20-win seasons that followed Moser's time there. Others said that his successor, Tim Jankovich, played candy-ass non-con schedules that puffed up the win totals. But it's hard to make that claim when Illinois State was 6-12 in the MVC in Moser's last year, and they were 13-5 in Jankovich's first year.

The Ramblers had another brush with Moser in 2007.... another game I attended... when Loyola played at St. Louis in Moser's first season as an assistant with Rick Majerus. The Ramblers were down by only two at halftime, but the Bilikins absolutely smoked Loyola in the second half for a 60-43 win.

And so, when Loyola named Moser as their new Head Coach in 2011, I was very, very skeptical. I tweeted my displeasure in the early days of my personal twitter account.... and the @OldTakesExposed twitter folks highlighted my tweets in the week before the Final Four in 2018.

I didn't like the way Moser ran off some players when he arrived. I thought the 7-23 record in his first year, and an MCC/HL record-worst 1-17 conference record in his first year was a really, really unnecessary embarrassment to the program (and a mar on the history of the program) just so he could set a low benchmark for comparison in the years forward. I was really angry. We weren't that bad-- we had Ben Averkamp, Jordan Hicks, Walt Gibler, and Christian Thomas. We were 6-7 in non-con games, with wins over Fordham, at Toledo, at Canisius, and at Bradley-- but we got swept by every Horizon League team except for the split with UIC? Several of the players Moser ran off-- Chim Kadima, Tom Neary, Shaun Adams-- went on to Division II St. Leo, where they knocked off the ACC's Miami (FL) in an exhibition game and reached the 2nd round of the Division II tournament.

In his first year in the MVC, Moser chased off more players-- basically, everyone over 6'7". Cody Johnson (6'10"), Matt O'Leary (6'8"), Nick Osbourne (6'8"), Jeremy King (6'10"), and Tanner Williams (6'7")-- all gone. And yes, I know that Tanner Williams had shin splint and leg issues, but some people say he was pushed.

But ironically, throwing out all the traditional big men was how Moser finally hit on his winning formula. I don't know if it was by design or necessity, but within two or three games into the 2014-15 season it was obvious Moser had put together a winning strategy. It was a variation on the switching defense, positionless basketball played at successful schools like Florida State, Dayton, and VCU. The only difference was, those other schools had players who were all athletic and 6'6". Loyola had players who were mostly 6'3", 6'4", with Montel James the only guy on the entire roster over 6'6". The team depended on length, athleticism, positioning, quickness, denying inside passes, etc. It was really extraordinary, and changed my extremely negative opinion of Moser to grudging admiration.

That season, the one that changed my mind about him, was the CBI year. I still think that was an important building block for the program, one that got us to the point where we could have a season like 2018. That was also the first full year of recruiting while in the MVC. It was the debut of Ben Richardson and Donte Ingram, and the first year for juco transfers Earl Peterson and Montel James. It was the senior season for Christian Thomas. We won our MTE that year, the Continental Tire Las Vegas Invitational, by defeating Texas Tech and Boise State. Moser might have earned his first above-.500 MVC record ever if it hadn't been for Milton Doyle's injury that season that caused him to miss 11 conference games where the team went 4-7. His first winning MVC campaign would have to wait until his ninth try, in 2017-18.

I don't want to give the impression that I think Moser isn't an excellent coach, and the absolute best person to coach Loyola next season and the year after. It's going to be a huge loss for the program, even if everyone who hasn't entered the transfer portal decides to stay, and even if his successor exceeds expectations. But it is possible (maybe unlikely at first, but certainly possible within 1-2 years) that Loyola could do just fine without him.

This is a setback, but not doomsday. The things that always set back the university in coaching transitions before was an unwillingness to pay what is required and underestimating the professionalism that is required from a coach and his assistants. We have great resources, a very good conference, good recruiting ties, a high quality AD, and many other advantages.

Thanks to Coach Moser for showing the fans, administration, students, and alumni what is possible. I'm not going to waste any good wishes on him, because it's us-- Loyola, our program, our students, our fanbase, etc. that really needs all the good wishes we can get after Moser left us suddenly for a paycheck. Maybe he'll do better in Norman than he did in Normal. Thanks a lot, keep in touch.

Moving on, next man up.


Great Post and thanks for the recap. That was interesting. One of the things I took from my time at Loyola and exposure to the Jesuits is to be thankful for what you have. Loyola is much better positioned for a coaching transition than it has been in the last 40 years.


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 Post subject: Re: And so it ends
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 11:10 pm 
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Posts: 239
01grad wrote:
I know one thing: I can’t wait until the NCAA sets up the tournament bracket so that we end Porter’s Sooners’ season.


Yes and then some. That would be sweet. Thanks for the memories coach but moving on, I hope we play and beat him every time.


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